My Auction TL8 - Diagnosis: Hole in cylinder 2

[Cogniz]

For the beginning of this tale, go here https://www.heavyequipmentforums.co...inues-and-what-to-do-now.115857/#post-1292668


Pulled the air filter housing and the DPF.

Planned on a leak down test but getting to the glow plugs was such a hassle I opted to just do the compression check. Cylinders 1, 3 and 4 were all over 400 psi, within 30 psi of each other.

Cylinder 2, 0 psi.



Pulled the valve cover and the injectors, of course #2 was clean as a whistle. The others had some carbon on them but not bad.



Tried to boroscope through the injector port but could only get down to the shoulder. Manually rotated the crank while videoing but could not really see much, but #2 did have an odd reflection. Now I know that was the hole.



So set about removing the turbo and exhaust manifold all together, then the inlet manifold. The inlet was considerably harder to get to everything with the fuel rail, harnesses, and lines on the left side of the motor.



Head came off pretty easily and the big reveal was this:



My question is this, can I just replace #2 piston with the kit / and the lower bearing? Or while I’m in there do I do all the pistons?

She has 2500 hours on her.

Guidance is appreciated. Thanks.

 

[Cogniz]

Again, I would appreciate some old gear wisdom here.
Replace one piston and move on, or while I'm there, replace all 4 pistons?

 

[ozarkag]

Your choice. For sure check cross hatch, probably at least hone and new rings.

You are aware that an injector failure is likely what took out the piston? New injectors, check/clean fuel rail, lines and pump. Check / clean fuel tank and lines.

 

[ozarkag]

Post a pic of cylinder walls.

 

[Cogniz]

Your choice. For sure check cross hatch, probably at least hone and new rings.

You are aware that an injector failure is likely what took out the piston? New injectors, check/clean fuel rail, lines and pump. Check / clean fuel tank and lines.

Ozarkag, is the cross hatch in the cylinder walls? Can I hone in place (drill attached hone?)
Would an injector failure show on the injector itself? It looks like the others. I'll admit I have no idea what punched the hole.
Copy on rail, line, pump and tank cleaning.
Thanks for the feedback.

 

[Simon C]

The injector tip is what blew the fuel at wrong angle and that is it, nice hole. Will have to find out if the liner is damaged, which it probably is. Then find out if it is a replaceable liner without a machine shop job. That far apart will warrant checking the rest out properly. If crosshatch is done wrong you will have exxcessive oil burn, and more problems in exhaust system.
Couple things to be mindful of.
Simon C

 

[Cogniz]

The injector tip is what blew the fuel at wrong angle and that is it, nice hole. Will have to find out if the liner is damaged, which it probably is. Then find out if it is a replaceable liner without a machine shop job. That far apart will warrant checking the rest out properly. If crosshatch is done wrong you will have exxcessive oil burn, and more problems in exhaust system.
Couple things to be mindful of.
Simon C

Simon.
Thanks for this info. Is the injector likely bad? Worth have them cleaned and tested?
I'll shoot some cylinder wall photos today. I appreciate this guidance.

 

[Nige]

Is the injector likely bad? Worth have them cleaned and tested?

If the machine hours are indeterminate and you are rebuilding the engine then IMHO a set of new genuine OEM squirters would be in order.

 

[Simon C]

Injector was shooting sideways, and yes it is junk. Nige beat me.

 

[ozarkag]

No liner. I suspect cylinder wall damage which would require engine removal, tear down, and rebore to oversize. IF no damage/ scoring yes can hand hone to try to get new rings to seat. Definitely a "shade tree" fix though.

 

[Cogniz]

Two videos.
One to show existing crosshatching, the second to show the wear from the holed piston.
Cyl 1:

Cyl 2

Possible, or idiotic, to attempt to hand hone #2? Pulling this motor out to send off to a shop blows the time and budget, bad. BUT, if I"m shooting myself in the foot trying to patch it, I get it.

Thanks again for y'all weighing in.

 

[Cogniz]

If the machine hours are indeterminate and you are rebuilding the engine then IMHO a set of new genuine OEM squirters would be in order.

Nige. Machine hours at 2400. IF I can work on the problem in machine, and I know I might be dreaming, is it worth at least testing the injector?
Cleaning and flow testing is $45. New injector is $600.
Thanks.

 

[Simon C]

Looked at that video of Cylinder number 2 and she is not so nice. It was probably water and fine dirt that took out the injector. At 2400 hours, who is to know the condition of the the other 3 injectors.
Yes expensive, but your time must be worth something and who wants to have to do again at maybe a greater cost. An ol sample from the auction house would of revealed lots of this problem, from excess fuel, to aluminum and iron counts way too high. Its yours now. Hope you got it for cheap.
Simon C

 

[Cogniz]

Thankfully, yes, I bought at a price that leaves room to fix things and still come out ahead.
You make a great point about time and money. At this point in my life I have more time than money so my shade tree mechanic approach.
I'm going to have the injectors cleaned and flow tested Wednesday.

And while not ideal, I have found videos of in-frame re-sleeving of Kubota's.
Do the sleeves come honed, or does the crosshatching have to be done once it's installed?

 

[Simon C]

Thankfully, yes, I bought at a price that leaves room to fix things and still come out ahead.
You make a great point about time and money. At this point in my life I have more time than money so my shade tree mechanic approach.
I'm going to have the injectors cleaned and flow tested Wednesday.

And while not ideal, I have found videos of in-frame re-sleeving of Kubota's.
Do the sleeves come honed, or does the crosshatching have to be done once it's installed?

Just to let you know, the injector that came out of the grenaded hole in piston is garbage, the other 3 can be tested. 1 injector will be new no matter what or you will pay dearly. If you have not mixed up the holes they come out of, you know which one is junk. Problem with a patch on the cylinder is that it will most likely cause problems in the exhaust downstream. ( Turbo wheel accumulating carbon )
If the machine has any filter after exhaust, will plug faster.
Simon C

 

[Simon C]

There is the possibility of the cylinder being honed a hair bigger, but I doubt it. Depends how deep the markings are when the aluminum comes off. Have seen lots of things done, but more shade tree mechanic stuff.

 

[Cogniz]

Excellent info, thank you Simon. I'll order an injector today.

 

[Vetech63]

Stay far away from auction equipment. This is the norm most of the time.

 

[Nige]

Stay far away from auction equipment. This is the norm most of the time.

Indeedy. There is usually a good reason why any machine goes to the auction, and it's not to give some buyer a good deal.

 

[Cmark]

Not everything at the auction is a POS, but every POS is at the auction.