Pipeline easement

[Welder Dave]

I had a guy from a land consulting firm come by this morning. They are planning a carbon recovery (CO2) pipeline that potentially would go across about the middle of my new property. The property is about a half mile/800m wide. They are paying $250 just for access to survey the property. It's hard to find out how much they pay for the easement because it is usually negotiated between land owners. It was suggested to consult a land use lawyer and the fee's might be covered. I did find something that suggested they pay from 5-$50 per foot. which would be $13,200 to $132,000. I would expect I would be on the lower end but they would need to knock down some tree's that are critical to sound mitigation. Construction might also interfere with my developing the property. They mentioned this spring when I hope to get approved. I have a firm that is submitting my rezoning application very shortly. Wondering if anyone has dealt with pipeline easements on their property and how they negotiated the best compensation? Is it best to have a lawyer or someone to help with negotiating? A pipeline easement would certainly help pay for my rezoning and development.

 

[cuttin edge]

Depends if it's government or private. If the city wants to build infrastructure through your property, it's going. My aunt had waterfront property. City put a forced main sewer line across her front lawn between her house and the river. She was notified a year in advance. Everything was restored when it was done but she didn't have a choice, and received no compensation. City must always have access to the property. My boss owned a piece of property. City wanted to build a road. They gave him what was considered fair market value. If he hadn't taken the offer, they would have taken it.

 

[_Weldman_]

Whichever way it goes just know your land value will go down and if you object more than likely they will invoke imminent domain. At least that is what they do in this country. My advice; play hardball to maximize what you get, then take the money and run cause you already are in the crosshairs.

 

[cfherrman]

When talking to them ask about having them put in that culvert you want and possibly put in a road, they need access somewhere and if you can get your property to have the access you can get a nice road out of it

 

[CM1995]

Whichever way it goes just know your land value will go down and if you object more than likely they will invoke imminent domain. At least that is what they do in this country. My advice; play hardball to maximize what you get, then take the money and run cause you already are in the crosshairs.

Good advice.

I've dealt with the power co on a high wire transmission line relocation where they wanted to take a portion of our property. The relocation was for a major new interstate interchange joining to interstates that had been in the work for over 40 years

For preface Southern Company might as well be a gov't agency due to the influence they hold over state and local gov't. I went in hard and refused the 1st offer. Agent brought the next offer and basically said "This is the final offer and if you don't accept we'll invoke imminent domain." The interchange was on schedule and the lines had to be moved.

So I took his offer after negotiating a few things in the easement that benefited us.

Unfortunately here that's the way it works.

 

[_Weldman_]

Good advice.

I've dealt with the power co on a high wire transmission line relocation where they wanted to take a portion of our property. The relocation was for a major new interstate interchange joining to interstates that had been in the work for over 40 years

For preface Southern Company might as well be a gov't agency due to the influence they hold over state and local gov't. I went in hard and refused the 1st offer. Agent brought the next offer and basically said "This is the final offer and if you don't accept we'll invoke imminent domain." The interchange was on schedule and the lines had to be moved.

So I took his offer after negotiating a few things in the easement that benefited us.

Unfortunately here that's the way it works.

Pipelines can't be just moved either unlike electric lines, every turn leads to less GPM and more PSI. One neighbor wanted power in as there is none back here, I couldn't stop them running the mile plus long worth of poles and wires, but I sure as hell could make them put it underground in which I did after a fight. I bet they sch it themselves when they went to drive across my property and found a crater in the road deeper than their vehicles with a loader sitting on top of the dirt mound heavier than anything they own.

 

[Welder Dave]

When talking to them ask about having them put in that culvert you want and possibly put in a road, they need access somewhere and if you can get your property to have the access you can get a nice road out of it

Yes, I considered they could build and/or upgrade the approach to meet the requirements to satisfy the transportation dept. A bunch of tree's would need to be removed too. The biggest concern there is the tree's contribute to noise mitigation. Will they pay extra for another form of noise mitigation like acoustic fence, etc. Also what do they do with the removed tree's. If the pipeline prevented or postponed my development could I claim extra for that and potential lost income. Another important issue is how close to the line can I disturb the ground for my development. They say farm equipment can cross pipelines no problem but what about a loaded dump truck.

I have a rural property so I don't think they could use imminent domain. It's not a pipeline for multiple residences. I called a couple surface rights law firms to get an idea what compensation might be but have to wait to hear back.

 

[Pixie]

After putting down timber mats, the logging company drove full log trucks across the 30" natural gas line on my property.

It was there when I bought the land so I can't help you on negociation.

 

[cfherrman]

There's several lines across Kansas and they zig zag and I have always guessed they went around trouble some landowners or ones that wanted an arm and a leg

 

[Welder Dave]

Good advice.

I've dealt with the power co on a high wire transmission line relocation where they wanted to take a portion of our property. The relocation was for a major new interstate interchange joining to interstates that had been in the work for over 40 years

For preface Southern Company might as well be a gov't agency due to the influence they hold over state and local gov't. I went in hard and refused the 1st offer. Agent brought the next offer and basically said "This is the final offer and if you don't accept we'll invoke imminent domain." The interchange was on schedule and the lines had to be moved.

So I took his offer after negotiating a few things in the easement that benefited us.

Unfortunately here that's the way it works.

I've read the first offer is just the start of negotiations. Apparently I might be able to have the pipeline route modified somewhat so it is the least impact on the property. I think I can also request it be buried deeper. They said std. burial is 1.2M/47". I'd like at least 5' depth and 6' would be better. If it's mostly sand I'm not sure how well the back fill will pack. I don't want to be dealing with a constant depression from vehicles having to cross the line. It's fairly solid now. Hopefully the info I found online regarding compensation is fairly accurate. If they were only paying a few thousand dollars it might not be worth the hassle. 13K or more would be worth it though. I think the pipeline owner usually pays the land owners legal fee's or it can be negotiated. There are a lot of things to consider that I wouldn't have thought about.

 

[cosmaar1]

I've read the first offer is just the start of negotiations. Apparently I might be able to have the pipeline route modified somewhat so it is the least impact on the property. I think I can also request it be buried deeper. They said std. burial is 1.2M/47". I'd like at least 5' depth and 6' would be better. If it's mostly sand I'm not sure how well the back fill will pack. I don't want to be dealing with a constant depression from vehicles having to cross the line. It's fairly solid now. Hopefully the info I found online regarding compensation is fairly accurate. If they were only paying a few thousand dollars it might not be worth the hassle. 13K or more would be worth it though. I think the pipeline owner usually pays the land owners legal fee's or it can be negotiated. There are a lot of things to consider that I wouldn't have thought about.

Get as much out of them as you can. As some people have mentioned, make sure you focus on the little stuff that could help you. Road access, land clearing, etc. Once they have machines on site, that stuff is easy for them.

 

[Baxsie]

I wonder if you can charge then a "subscription" (lease) ? Like $2K / year inflation adjusted or soemthing. If you stay there for another 30 years . . .

Maybe $5K ?/ year ?

And they have to remove the pipeline and restore the land if they want to end the lease.

It would be nice to be on the receiving end of a subscription instead of the paying end.

 

[Tones]

Read a terrible story about CO 2 pipeline in the US, dammed if it'd want to be anywhere near the thing.

 

[DM&RDBulldog]

Im in the states and im sure our experience will differ but if anything hire a land use attorney to guide you through negotiations. You need to sit down and brainstorm every possible effect this is going to have on your property and your personal, both current and future.

As a land developer most of my career ive dealt with many natural gas, fiber optic, and other utilities on properties I owned and were preparing for development. Good points have been brought up above but its best to at least consult with legal as there are angles you can negotiate you would never think of just from lack of exposure.

 

[Welder Dave]

Thankfully Alberta has very high standards for pipelines. If they have a public forum I could ask about the actual construction of the pipeline. What wall thickness of pipe, max. pressure, corrosion allowance, nearest energency shut off valve, what welding type and filler metal and if it is 100% X-Ray of all welds. These are all common criteria for pressure vessels and piping and a pipeline is very similar. From what I've read you can have the pipeline pay for a land lawyer to represent you. My property isn't considered very good but is perfect for an off road vehicle park. If the pipeline restricts me from having any riding or development within the 60M/200' right of way they better be offering me significantly more for loss of land use. Will also need to have a suitable crossing area for vehicles including a dump truck and single axle water truck. The pipeline might think my property would be the least affected and offer less but they'd be wrong. The pipeline could also slow my development and cost me lost revenue. There are a lot of things to consider.

 

[Tones]

I wonder if you got a plan drawn up for your land use and submit it toot sweat would be a good idea. If you then got an agreement in principle would be helpful to your cause. I understand you may not want to show your hand just yet.

 

[Welder Dave]

I'm not sure if I should wait to see if the pipeline is likely to proceed or look into it more. I just hired a firm to help with my rezoning and a pipeline could pose some serious issues as far as my development. Pipeline right of way looks to be 30M/100' on either side. A 200' strip across 1/2 mile of my property that I can't do anything on I think would warrant some pretty serious compensation.

Farmers can generally still put crops in and use their land as they did before but I want to put in an off road vehicle park. I'd have to have at least one crossing to allow heavy equipment/passenger vehicles but it would be a big problem if bikes or quads couldn't ride on or across the right of way except in a designated spot. It cuts off half the property if I wanted to have some trails or riding in a sand pit like area if riders didn't want to ride the track. The track might have to be moved as well. I hope to get approved in the spring/early summer. I can't do anything if they are putting the pipeline in when I want to start my development. I think that could warrant more compensation too because the sooner I can get customers the sooner I get some income. Some tree's will have to be taken out as well. Can I request the pipeline install or build something to replace the natural sound reduction of the tree's? I'll talk with the guy helping with my rezoning and see what he thinks. I hope the county wouldn't reject my rezoning because of a pipeline going in. If that happened the pipeline better have deep pockets to buy the property. I have a professional appraisal of $910,000 done in March 2025. It's high by about $250K according to the former owner but it was done by a highly qualified firm and is very detailed. If it wasn't stressing me out already, a pipeline throws another wrench in the spokes!

 

[Welder Dave]

Update on the pipeline.
The land agent came by today to outline the compensation. They are paying everyone with similar type properties the same. I would get $7000/acre for the right of way ($14,140) and $7000/acre for temporary work space ($27,300 or $14,000/acre total). I would also get $2960 for the entry fee which totals $44,401. There would also be $1500 for an extra survey and $1500 entry fee. I think the last two items are basically an early signing bonus. $47,401 to start with seems pretty good to me. Prime farm land with #1 soil is being paid a rate of $8500/acre ($17,000/acre) for the same criteria my compensation is calculated. I'm having an experienced lawyer review it and believe the pipeline pays the lawyer's fee's as well as any costs for negotiating the compensation.

After the pipeline is completed I still get to negotiate damages as a result of the pipeline. This could include the loss of tree's and inconvenience and loss of revenue if my rezoning goes through. They're planning to build the pipeline about the same time as now next year. He didn't think they'd bring a tree chipper but they could buck the trees for firewood. I would look into renting a chipper. Wood chips added to a sand/loam track would help hold moisture to keep the dust down. I think if I could get $5-$10,000 or more compensation for damages would be fantastic. Another great thing is I wouldn't be restricted from driving on the pipeline whether it's a dump truck or my MX track crossed it. I just couldn't build anything on the pipeline like a storage building.

It does sound pretty generous to me so I don't think I need to play hardball. From what I've read land agents are required to be neutral and not biased towards either party. They're supposed to have both parties best interests in mind. He said about 75% of land owners have already signed the agreement. Curious if people on the forum think it's pretty fair compensation?

 

[CM1995]

Another great thing is I wouldn't be restricted from driving on the pipeline whether it's a dump truck or my MX track crossed it.

Make sure you can cross the pipeline with tracked equipment. We have several gasoline/diesel pipelines here and they do not like it when a tracked machine crosses over. This pipeline may be different but I'd still check.

I don't know anything about the land value in your area so not much advice on that part.

 

[Welder Dave]

I said I'd need to be able to drive a dump truck across and it was no problem. I also mentioned my Cat. If I need access while they are working on the pipeline they will put rig mats down so I can cross. The right of way for this pipeline is much smaller than a typical pipeline at only 10m/33ft. I was surprised that I could even have my MX track go over the pipeline. It will buried about 4ft and is a 10" line. It will be fairly heavy wall pipe as the maximum pressure of the liquid CO2 is over 2100 PSI. I'm thinking maybe because it is heavy wall pipe it will be considerably less prone to damage from vehicles and equipment crossing it. From what I've read it has to be welded with a low hydrogen process rather than a cellulose process. IE/7018 compared to 6010.

The $7000/acre they are basing the compensation on is about $1500/acre more than the property is worth. It's sandy property and isn't much good for farming or anything else but is absolutely perfect for dirt bikes. It is bone dry while any other track is still under water. My old track is essentially flooded right now. The new property could have riders almost a month ago. I could make some good money in the spring next year if my rezoning is approved. I'd be the first place open by a longshot! I'd much rather deal with a dry track than a track that is severely affected by rain.