Repairing Tilt Lever Failure in Loaders: Is Welding a Viable Solution?

[mdrifki]

Hello everyone,

I'm seeking advice and insights on repairing a tilt lever failure in an underground loader. Specifically, I want to know if welding is a viable solution for this type of failure. Has anyone had experience with welding a failed tilt lever? What are the considerations and best practices to ensure a successful repair? Any recommendations or alternative solutions are also welcome.

Thank you!

 

[92U 3406]

I'm not much of a welder but I think you're going to be SOL with welding that if its cast iron.

Even if its weldable the amount of material needed to be removed in order to achieve full weld penetration will be substantial. Not to mention it will be almost impossible to keep straight and square so you will more than likely need to have get everything line bored straight and true again.

IMO, it'll be better to replace it.

 

[sawmilleng]

I think your first thing to do is answer a few questions:

1. what is the time frame necessary? Is it a screaming panic to get the iron moving again?
2. is cost a concern? If a panic to get it running, usually cost isn't usually an issue.

Next question:
1. Can I locate a good used tilt lever at a reasonable price and not at a huge shipping cost?

Even if time isn't an issue, you need to know the following:
1. How much is a new tilt lever? Your own repairs need to cost less than a new one.
2. How long is the delivery on a new tilt lever?
3. Does Cat provide a recommended welding process for the tilt lever? I'm guessing its some sort of cast steel that MIGHT be weldable. But knowing the correct process is essential.
4. If not, will Cat at least tell you what it is made of so you can track down a welding process? (And an annealing process if necessary)
5. Figure on line boring the lever after welding to get proper pin clearances and dead nuts parallel bored holes. Either welding up the bores or boring and sleeving.
6. Do you have access to a welding shop or welder who can do the recommended process? Do you have access to a machine shop who can do the bores or re-sleeving work?

Hope this helps a little!

Jon.

 

[mdrifki]

I'm not much of a welder but I think you're going to be SOL with welding that if its cast iron.

Even if its weldable the amount of material needed to be removed in order to achieve full weld penetration will be substantial. Not to mention it will be almost impossible to keep straight and square so you will more than likely need to have get everything line bored straight and true again.

IMO, it'll be better to replace it.

Yeah, I agree. We plan to include line boring and intend to weld with a double V on both sides. It will require removing a significant amount of material, which we will then fill with weld. Thanks for your input.

 

[mdrifki]

I think your first thing to do is answer a few questions:

1. what is the time frame necessary? Is it a screaming panic to get the iron moving again?
2. is cost a concern? If a panic to get it running, usually cost isn't usually an issue.

Next question:
1. Can I locate a good used tilt lever at a reasonable price and not at a huge shipping cost?

Even if time isn't an issue, you need to know the following:
1. How much is a new tilt lever? Your own repairs need to cost less than a new one.
2. How long is the delivery on a new tilt lever?
3. Does Cat provide a recommended welding process for the tilt lever? I'm guessing its some sort of cast steel that MIGHT be weldable. But knowing the correct process is essential.
4. If not, will Cat at least tell you what it is made of so you can track down a welding process? (And an annealing process if necessary)
5. Figure on line boring the lever after welding to get proper pin clearances and dead nuts parallel bored holes. Either welding up the bores or boring and sleeving.
6. Do you have access to a welding shop or welder who can do the recommended process? Do you have access to a machine shop who can do the bores or re-sleeving work?

Hope this helps a little!

Jon.

Thanks, Jon. To answer your questions:

Time and money are not issues for me. We want to attempt to repair it as part of a research project, so buying a new one is not an option for us.

We want to determine what it is made of, but CAT only provided a hint that the material is "MS025," which I'm not familiar with; it might be a code for some material.

Regarding the line boring process, we have done it before, and we have access to both welding and machine shops.

Do you happen to know the material code "MS025" or a similar material you've worked with?

 

[Legdoc]

Out of morbid curiosity how much is a new one?

 

[heymccall]

 

[cat951b]

Hi Mdrifki,

I think this is a forged part, not a casting. I could not determine the quality of the material. If I were you and the new part was not an option, I would manufacture a more robust new one from a material with high tensile strength.

 

[Cliffy]

$56,478.17 aud.
I would sack the operator and give it a go.

 

[Nige]

We want to determine what it is made of, but CAT only provided a hint that the material is "MS025," which I'm not familiar with; it might be a code for some material.

You got this info from Cat therefore I assume the machine is an Elphinstone underground loader. Is that correct.? Do you have the OEM Part Number for the tilt lever.?

I've never heard of "MS025". Cat Material Codes are generally in the format 1Exxxx, colloquially referred to as the "1E Number". Believe it or not but there are two 1E Numbers right there in the photo, plus a Date Code of 07/02/2022 if I am reading it correctly. I assume that was the date of manufacture of the part.

EDIT: 1E1123 is cast steel - 0.17-0.19% carbon.

Bearing in mind the location of the structural failure of the tilt lever in my opinion there are two chances of you being able to successfully repair it by welding - slim and none.

I think this is a forged part, not a casting.

Every tilt lever I have come across on Cat equipment has either been cast steel or some type of fabrication. From the photos the OP's lever is obviously not fabricated so ergo it's cast.

Before attempting any sort of "repair or replacement" decision I would suggest a close look at the operating techniques because, again in my experience, tilt lever failures of any type are a direct result of poor operating practices. Especially repeated banging of the tilt lever against the stops while dumping the bucket.

 

[sawmilleng]

Here is a link to a Cat spec on 1E1123 cast steel. It also talks about weld repairs to the steel which may be helpful.

Caterpillar specification 1E2679_Chg05_24-Mar-2009 - Free Download PDF

Caterpillar inspection standard...

kupdf.net

Hope this helps!

Also, I fully agree with Nige on his comment of looking at the operators. They may be slamming the bucket against the stops to dislodge stuck mud or just because they are cowboys.

If you are investigating the problem for reasons why the link broke, it may be worth looking into ways of cushioning the stroke of the hydraulic cylinder when it approaches the end of its stroke. There are both mechanical methods that start cutting off the oil flow as the piston gets close the the end of the stroke as well as electronic stroke sensors that control a valve to do the same thing. I have also seen industrial UHMW polyethylene donuts used in the ends of cylinders for damping, but they may not be robust enough for what you are looking at.

Sometimes a baseball bat to the side of the operators head is the only way to fix it!!

YMMV
Jon.

 

[Nige]

It also talks about weld repairs to the steel which may be helpful.

I'd just like to point out that when that document refers to "weld repair" it is in relation to new castings that are found with defects that are being considered for repair in order to be accepted by QC into the production (machining) process. Such references obviously do not envisage the welding repair process being applied to a casting that has failed in service like this one has.

 

[.RC.]

 

[mdrifki]

Here is a link to a Cat spec on 1E1123 cast steel. It also talks about weld repairs to the steel which may be helpful.

Caterpillar specification 1E2679_Chg05_24-Mar-2009 - Free Download PDF

Caterpillar inspection standard...

kupdf.net

Hope this helps!

Also, I fully agree with Nige on his comment of looking at the operators. They may be slamming the bucket against the stops to dislodge stuck mud or just because they are cowboys.

If you are investigating the problem for reasons why the link broke, it may be worth looking into ways of cushioning the stroke of the hydraulic cylinder when it approaches the end of its stroke. There are both mechanical methods that start cutting off the oil flow as the piston gets close the the end of the stroke as well as electronic stroke sensors that control a valve to do the same thing. I have also seen industrial UHMW polyethylene donuts used in the ends of cylinders for damping, but they may not be robust enough for what you are looking at.

Sometimes a baseball bat to the side of the operators head is the only way to fix it!!

YMMV
Jon.

Thank you, Jon, for the PDF and your valuable input. We'll definitely look into the operators' practices to ensure proper handling of the equipment. Your suggestions are much appreciated!

 

[mdrifki]

You got this info from Cat therefore I assume the machine is an Elphinstone underground loader. Is that correct.? Do you have the OEM Part Number for the tilt lever.?

I've never heard of "MS025". Cat Material Codes are generally in the format 1Exxxx, colloquially referred to as the "1E Number". Believe it or not but there are two 1E Numbers right there in the photo, plus a Date Code of 07/02/2022 if I am reading it correctly. I assume that was the date of manufacture of the part.

EDIT: 1E1123 is cast steel - 0.17-0.19% carbon.

Bearing in mind the location of the structural failure of the tilt lever in my opinion there are two chances of you being able to successfully repair it by welding - slim and none.


Every tilt lever I have come across on Cat equipment has either been cast steel or some type of fabrication. From the photos the OP's lever is obviously not fabricated so ergo it's cast.

Before attempting any sort of "repair or replacement" decision I would suggest a close look at the operating techniques because, again in my experience, tilt lever failures of any type are a direct result of poor operating practices. Especially repeated banging of the tilt lever against the stops while dumping the bucket.

Thank you for your detailed observations. Yes, the machine in question is an Elphinstone underground loader. I don't have the OEM part number for the tilt lever at the moment, but I will look into it.

Thank you again for your insights!

 

[MarcusZ1967]

This is a truck dog bone but has good ideas for welding and boring on a mill bed..

 

[AusDave]

Ask Kurtis at Cutting Edge Engineering what he suggests could be done assuming you’re in Australia. He has a pretty good track record of repairing or fabricating parts to OEM specs at better than OEM prices.

 

[Welder Dave]

I didn't watch the complete video's but fast forwarded through them. A couple things I noticed (or maybe I missed) were the lack of preheat/post heat and not allowing the weld to expand and contract. With such a large amount of filler metal required (especially on a single bevel) there would be a lot of internal stresses built up because the welded pieces were restrained in the finished position. Peening would help some but the best solution to relief all the stress would be to stress relief the entire part in a stress relieving oven or with portable induction heating and ceramic blankets.
Repairing a bore with weld and line boring isn't the same as repairing a fully broken off ear. Could the tilt arm be repaired as strong as new?? Maybe but it would require some very exacting procedures not the last of which is proper heat treating and stress relieving. Interpass temperature could be very important as well. You see these repairs done and they look real nice but rarely do you see if they're still holding together after being in service for 500,1000 or more hours. As an experiment it may be worth trying. For a production machine where downtime is costly, it's probably better to replace. That said, the new part may be able to be reinforced with additional pieces but that would have to be done using very strict procedures as well.

 

[mdrifki]

EDIT: 1E1123 is cast steel - 0.17-0.19% carbon.

how do you know this 1E1123 is cast steel and the carbon properties?

 

[Nige]

how do you know this 1E1123 is cast steel and the carbon properties?

I have my sources and I would guarantee their accuracy.