//// Questions regarding new to me 1985 International S1900 ////

[Andyinchville]

HI All,

Recently bought a 1985 International S1900 box truck with a DT466 engine and a 5+2 drive train and I have a few questions that hopefully gurus here know about.

1) For some reason, the trans is hard to get into gears....
Years ago I had a 1981 Dodge Dually truck with a 4 speed that was hard to get into gear when the clutch grabbed at the very top of the pedal travel.....The solution to this was to manually adjust the linkage until the clucth grabbed closer to the mid point of pedal travel rather than towards the top....the truck shifted nicely then.

I am suspecting the same thing is happening now (i.e. this truck only engages the clutch towards the top of the pedal travel).
I have not been able to locate any info online abut how to adjust the linkage for this truck (I did run across lots of instructions about opening an inspection panel on the belhousing and removing a retainer and turning a "ring" to adjust the clutch BUT I can't help but think this is for "big" trucks and not my little medium duty with a synchronized tranny.....

Any ideas on how to adjust things so my clutch engages earlier in the pedal travel?
Why is it it that my previous truck acted that way and the solution was to make it grab earlier in the pedal travel....I 'm just truing to get my head around how the earlier engagement made getting into gears "easier"

2) I have a 2 speed rear in the truck and it seems to work....I am still getting used to it.

Is it possible to switch from high range to low range while at a standstill (say at a red light)
Not that I would want to, but is it possible to switch from low range to high range sitting at a light?

3) I am sometimes leery of using the 2 speed because I have read that it is possible to get stuck in neutral (is this only if the shift motor gives out and breaks?) or can this just happen?

4) What fluid goes in the tranny and what fluid goes in the rear with the 2 speed?

Thanks in advance for any and all help on this.

Andrew

 

[dieseldog5.9]

If there is an inspection cover on bottom of clutch housing, take it off and look inside for an adjuster bolt, with the engine off. May have to bump engine around to find it. If no inspection cover then no clutch internal adjustment, but your 5 speed could have an adjustment. The important part is that the pedal when released has free play, I think international says 1.5 to 2 inches of free play measured at the pedal.

2 speeds take a certain finess to drive well. Some guys I know run it as a straight 5 and split up for a sixth gear. As I remember going up is not to bad, down shifting the split can be tricky.

 

[Junkyard]

Down only when sitting still. Low to high while driving is fine, depending on ratios you may have to drop a gear in the trans after you shift rears up to high side. Above advice on evaluating what clutch is correct. You'll either see a hex head adjuster or a tab held in with a bolt that you remove to turn adjustment ring. Google the adjustment procedure once you determine what you have or we can walk you through it.

 

[RZucker]

My last IH service truck was a S1954 with a D466, IIRC it had a threaded release sleeve with a large lock nut to adjust the clutch free play. Its been 15 years plus so I don't remember exactly how I did it. Don't monkey with the external linkage if that's what you have. Personally, I would just take it to a good truck shop and see if they will work with you, and maybe show you how its done as they do it.

 

[doublewide]

Info on 2 speed operation;

I use 50 weight transmission oil in my F800;

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/...MInM7hjvre1gIVj7rACh1FHwsFEAYYASABEgKOgfD_BwE

I use 75 w 90 full synthetic in the 2 speed rear;

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/luc-10072/overview/

Never try and shift the rear while going down grade.

Yes you can shift it while standing still, like sitting at a light, etc....

If I am running around unloaded, I will most likely shift the rear once, usually at the bottom, 1 L, 1 H, 2 H.....

But, if I am loaded I will split every gear if I need to.

But never while going down grade!

 

[Andyinchville]

Hi

There is an inspection opening for the trans...the cover was missing.

The trans is a spicer....

On my old dodge I used to adjust things in the linkages....pic if linkage adjustment shown also...

Is there anything wrong with adjusting the linkages only to get the clutch to engage at a different point?

I'm not sure there's anything inside the inspection cover to physically adjust I did read about some sort of holder between two bolts but I didn't seem like I had a lot of two bolts in there for holder to sit inside of...

I did see a grease fitting on a spline I'm assuming that needs a hit or two of Grease every now and again

Any ideas on my clutch adjustment procedure based on my pictures?

Thanks

 

[Tenwheeler]

You normally want at least 1 1/2 " free play at the top of the pedal. The adjuster is as RZucker said. In picture number one between the throughout bearing and the pressure plate are two nuts. They have notches in them. There is probably a tool for them I have never seen. Get a chisel about 1 1/2 feet long. Grind the point to about 1/4 inch flat. You want to turn them not cut them. One is a jam nut ( on the right I believe ) and the other is part of a threaded sleeve. Loosen the jam nut and turn the sleeve moving the throughout bearing toward the transmission until correct free play is correct. Lock the jam nut. Some people adjust and modify the linkage getting them all out of wack. I cannot tell you how to get back to normal if it is clustered up. If you can find parts of springs and such in the bottom of the housing it needs a clutch.

 

[RZucker]

You normally want at least 1 1/2 " free play at the top of the pedal. The adjuster is as RZucker said. In picture number one between the throughout bearing and the pressure plate are two nuts. They have notches in them. There is probably a tool for them I have never seen. Get a chisel about 1 1/2 feet long. Grind the point to about 1/4 inch flat. You want to turn them not cut them. One is a jam nut ( on the right I believe ) and the other is part of a threaded sleeve. Loosen the jam nut and turn the sleeve moving the throughout bearing toward the transmission until correct free play is correct. Lock the jam nut. Some people adjust and modify the linkage getting them all out of wack. I cannot tell you how to get back to normal if it is clustered up. If you can find parts of springs and such in the bottom of the housing it needs a clutch.

He also has a clutch brake... although greasy/oily looking that will need to be adjusted with the external linkage before the internal clutch adjustment. Now we are back to finding a local guy that knows what he's doing, and will do it for 50 bucks or a case of beer. I will not even try to explain this process to a person that has no idea of what he is looking at.

 

[Andyinchville]

HI All,

Been researching this a bit further....

It seems that I have a "Valeo" pull type clutch clutch arrangement.

This video seems to help a lot (I'll post it here to see what you all think...just because its online doesn't mean what the person is saying is correct....what do you all think of the video and what he says....is he correct?)....link below

This video around the 2:30 point in the video also speaks of the "Valeo" type clutch adjustment....

I'm still seeing if I have a clutch brake but I don't think I do (I'll have to crawl back under the truck to see for sure since my picture was a little blurry....my close up vision wasn't really super good and it appears my camera has the same up close issues...Maybe it needs glasses too! )

I bought a long tire tool I will grind and modify so I can use it as a punch to spin the lock nut to make the adjustment.

NOTE: My tranny was missing the inspection cover so in the event things are rusted in there....IS it safe to spray PB or WD up into the lock ring area to loosen stuff up ?....If I get oil on the clutch I am guessing that's not a good thing....

I have to find something 1/2" (if clutch brake) or 3/4" (no clutch brake per the first video) in diameter to use as a gauge for seeing how things are currently adjusted and if / how much things need to be adjusted.

The second video seems to say the 1/8 gap comes after adjusting the clutch by loosening the lock ring and lengthening or shortening to make the "gap" but the first video seems to say adjust the big gap to either 1/2 inch or 3/4 (depending on if clutch brake or no clutch brake respectively and then having to adjust linkage (?)....

I am almost inclined to believe the seco0nd video more since it was from a professional company (and in truth hopefully they are right since it is a one and done adjustment)....Any ideas?

Thanks for your input and any further comments before I try this would be greatly appreciated.... I may attempt this tomorrow or the day after...

Andrew

 

[Tenwheeler]

Yours is the style without a clutch brake. Clutch brakes require a flat surface on the transmission front bearing cover. That can be seen in picture one and yours is not.
Video one is easier to understand and probably the same unit as yours. Video two is from Mid America, a clutch rebuilder. I have installed a truck load of their clutches. Almost never a problem weather failure was abuse or possibly a defect. They are a good company that stand behind their product. The clutch in their video is much larger than yours. While he talks about both styles I had difficulty following some of it. Maybe I was mixing up the two?
If it is not hard to put your truck in gear stopped with the engine running. Hard to get out of gear? Never creeps with the clutch depressed. The clutch is probably not your hard shifting problem with the clutch you have. If it is out of adjustment, no free play, I would expect it to slip. Not saying it's not possible just my opinion.

 

[funwithfuel]

Here, try this.
https://www.scribd.com/document/98488966/Lipe-Clutch-Installation-Service-Manual
These old girls are pretty rare around the midwest. Good luck

 

[Tenwheeler]

Some good information there fwf.

 

[funwithfuel]

I hated those old things. Not enough room in the inspection hole for 2 paws at the same time. Always swapped spicer easy pedal in when possible

 

[Andyinchville]

HI All,

Update : I bought 3 feet of 1/2" OD solid rod (cut down to about 16") and made myself about a 45 degree angle on one end to make a tool to tap on the lock ring (nut?) to loosen it from the freewheel side so the throw out bearing assembly could be moved to try to make the dimension "a" ( on the second video or one of the company's other videos) happen...

Dimension "a" being the distance from the back side of the throw out bearing to the rear of the transmission...there is a gap to the trans brake pad (if present).

I had no way to accurately measure the dimension "a" before since the gap was so large my 1/2" rod if used as a feeler gauge would have gotten lost in the space .....I would estimate it was well over an inch though.

For fun I tried to measure the free play at the pedal before dickering with things....best I could measure it I was at about 1/4" free play at the top of the pedal.

I managed to knock the lock ring loose and made my adjustment to get dimension "a" down to 1/2"

After doing this I noticed my free play at the pedal increased drastically.....I'd dare say I have about 1" now up from about 1/4" before (at least based on the way I was measuring it....height from pedal to the floor when pressing on the pedal by hand until it hits a "stop" point....done the same way before and after the adjustment.

I have not driven the truck with the updated clutch adjustment yet because I am agonizing about the dimension "A" still....

I have seen many write ups and instructions saying it (dimension "a" should be 1/2" but then again I have seen and heard that WITHOUT a clutch brake that dimension "a" should be 3/4").

I have NO clutch brake so I wonder if I should go with those who say 1/2" or do the 3/4" (if 3/4" I'd have to buy some more solid rod to use as a feeler gauge).

So many things to thing about....

Any final inputs would be great....I'll keep you posted.

Thanks for all the help thus far....

Andrew

 

[funwithfuel]

Have you establish whether or not you have a single or double disk clutch

 

[Tenwheeler]

Drive it and see how it does where it is adjusted at now.

 

[Andyinchville]

Update: l Just finished shortening one of the linkages (had to heat to break the turnbuckle loose) to get my 1/8" fork to throw out bearing distance....

I greased up all the linkages with zerks, checked tranny oil level, and about to test her out....

Hopefully it'll work like new ! ....It was really out of adjustment before...